Tom Horne Testifies, Channels Bill Clinton

pool photo/Tom Tingle/Arizona Republic
Horne's outreach director Kathleen Winn under oath, playing the good soldier, but to the wrong general

Horne said he didn't even know Winn was producing an ad.

Try as I might to suspend disbelief, I don't understand why Horne -- who knows election law, and by his own admission had advised Winn on "the rules" before she supposedly "left" his campaign to run BLA -- just had to speak to Winn about this deal, over and over again.

I mean, Horne is a rich guy who wrote an entire book on construction law. He has a bunch of wealthy pals who double as campaign donors, such as former governor Fife Symington and Scottsdale attorney Mark Goldman, among others.

Also, in 2010 he happened to be the Superintendent of Public Schools, and you're telling me that he doesn't know anyone else to call for additional real estate advice other than the woman running an IE in support of him, a woman he's supposed to maintain a modicum of distance from as she's operating the IE?

Like we say down South, that dog don't hunt.

Then there's the closest thing to a smoking gun in this case: Horne's October 27, 2010 e-mail to Winn, wherein he forwarded an e-mail string to her, one that included polling data and strategic advice on how to beat Rotellini.

click for larger image
The October 27 e-mail, the closest thing to a smoking gun in the case

Horne had already sent the information to Casey Phillips, an official at the Republican State Leadership Committee, which was funding Winn's ad to the tune of $350,000, about $100K less than expected.

"I forwarded this to casey," reads Horne's message to Winn. "Maybe with this we can. Try again for the hundred k [sic]."

Winn, in turn, forwarded it all to Murray, who was so alarmed by receiving it that he forwarded it to his firm's counsel, explaining that he had warned Winn "on several occasions" to cease contact with Horne and anyone else involved in Horne's campaign.

Murray's warnings were ignored.

Faced with this evidence at the hearing, Horne did pretty much the only thing he could do. He admitted he sent the e-mail to Winn with the intent of firing her up to ask the RSLC for more dough.

"In my mind there was nothing improper about talking to the independent campaign about fundraising," Horne stated. "I couldn't talk about the expenditure, but I could talk about fundraising. So I sent her the poll in the hope, as the opposing attorneys say...she could use the poll to get the $100,000 that I'd been told she'd been short."

Later, Deputy Yavapai County Attorney Jack Fields asked him how he happened to know Winn was shy $100K at the time.

"I had been told that," he replied. "I didn't know how reliable it was. I was getting a lot of calls, during a campaign you get a lot of calls from people saying...`I hear there's going to be an independent campaign in your favor, don't worry.' You know? So, you get calls like that."

He got a lot of calls all right. From October 15, 2010 to October 28, 2010, more than five hours of calls took place between Horne and Winn's cell phones.

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danzigsdaddy topcommenter

hold on a Tom Horne, the guy who thinks he's smarter than everybody, doesnt understand a email? the guy smarter than everybody else, doesnt know how to cut and paste messages, or even select content? wouldnt that be kind of like "dont open an email if you dont know who its from"??? if you are an elected official and you get an email you dont understand......................why would you forward it with your name attached to it? also if you dont read it or understand do you know  who to forward it to?  Tom knew who to forward it to, 

MaskedMagician1967 topcommenter

Horne's done. It's official.

He just admitted he violated the law. The same law he swore to uphold.

Boot him out. Now.


Arizonan's Do you know how to:

#1  Lie.

#2  Cheat.

#3. Steal.

#4. Want to be a Bigot.

#5. Help cover up, and hide Corruption

#6. Cook Record Books.

#7.  Use others around you as Scape Goats..

#8. Accept Bribes.

If you answered yes to any or all of these questions please run for Political Office in Arizona.

This message is in no way affiliated with the M.C.S.O., the Attorney Generals Office, the Maricopa County Attorneys Office, or the G.O.P. Party, and or G.O.P. Extremist wing Nuts or Neo Nazi's.


Campaign finance law is not always easy to understand ,but from what I have been reading hear, it sure looks like Horne violated the law. It is about time Arizona gets an AG with integrity . This is why I will vote for Rotellini.   

Cozz topcommenter

Calm, you bet, Horne like all politicians are professional liars and can lie through their teeth as calm as can be.

ConcernedCitizenAZ topcommenter

""I absolutely did not give any input in the ad," Horne declared. "We never talked about it...I'm absolutely certain. We knew we could not and we did not."

Shades of NJ Gov. Christie? 


A thought bubble over Horne's head would read, I got this...She really digs me. 


A thought bubble over Judge Eigenheer's head would read:  This guy is so full of shit. 


A thought bubble over Judge Eigenheer's head would read: This guy is so full of shit. 


I want to see some perjury  here, obvious lies under oath are obvious.


5 hours of calls in 13 days, who is Horne trying to B.S. Horne is a shining example of what is wrong in this state. peace

ConcernedCitizenAZ topcommenter

Friends, real estate and Arizona "prison" state?

Mark  Goldman, friend of Chuck Coughlin, High Ground lobbyist / CCA?  Or Mark Goldman, friend of Andrew Thomas, who testified in the Arizona Supreme Court disciplinary hearings against Andrew Thomas / Lisa Aubuchon (both disbarred April 2012) and Rachel Alexander (sanctioned)? Who are all these people?  

Real estate transactions? Who's handling the real estate transactions and land deals for the jails, prisons, detention centers in the state of Arizona?  Just saying... as Arizona has ramped up to become the "dumping" grounds for other states' prisoners, creating liabilities for Arizona's taxpayers. Meanwhile, the conservative states have cut their prison population, reformed draconian sentencing laws and saved THEIR taxpayers hundreds of millions of dollars -- while, our elected officials are denigrating their offices and wasting taxpayers dollars on their soap operas?

Reminds us... (Clinton hearing) while the media and the nation were focused on the semen on the "blue dress", Bin Laden was planning eventual attacks --  the ancient monuments in Afghanistan, followed by 9/11. 

What is really going on behind the scenes in Arizona? The office of the Attorney General has been disgraced and lacks credibility under its current leadership. Real estate deals about what? The public has a right to know about these "land" deals.  Who's investigating this?

TommyCollins topcommenter

Deny, deny, deny.

But, at least he didn't feign having 'the flu' and he didn't use the 'I don't recall' stature of the local shurf.

He simply tried to lie his way out of the conspiracy.


As always.

david_saint01 topcommenter

lol i was waiting for him to say "i did not have relations with that woman..we just like to hang in bed at lunch"

ConcernedCitizenAZ topcommenter

Mr. Lemons, Excellent reporting! Have to come here to find the truth.



"I did not criminally conspire with that Woman, Mrs. Chenal, ur I mean Winn."

"What is is?"


@Cozz  And that is the real reason lie detector test are inadmissible. If everything you say is a lie, then there is no difference to detect.


@ david-saint01

I wonder when they were "wrapping up the property swap", what other property they swapped?

ConcernedCitizenAZ topcommenter

@royalphoenix  What applies to the people should apply to those in a position of awesome power and trust.

Reminder: Arizona's zero tolerance policies - preponderance of evidence send ordinary people straight to jail, where they wear jail stripes for their court appearances, not silk jackets and coiffed hair.

Those who enable the accused are treated as if they committed the crime as well. Like "felony murder", even though the person was sitting in a car blocks away and didn't even know it was going to happen and a person was shot and killed.

The system, the prosecutors and lawmakers created for "others", should apply to them. And especially, the top State prosecutor -- the state attorney general. The AG's office has NO credibility and has been turned into a mockery.

The top prosecutors are in a position of trust and awesome power over the people and the federal and taxpayers dollars that pour into the state.

The AG grandstands at the podium that he will take this case --Debra Milke -- to the U.S. Supreme Court myself!! -- after a higher court, the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, overturned her conviction and sentence, and gave Arizona's justice system a scathing opinion. 

Until Arizona's prosecutors get the same punishment, they want for "others", there will not be equal or fair justice in the state. 

Whose paying for the team of defense lawyers that the ordinary person could never afford for themselves, not even one of them?

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