El Mirage Officials Snub City's Only Gas Station, Take Business to Neighboring Cities

Categories: Wild, Wild West
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El Mirage city officials, cops and firefighters filled up their gas tanks at the city's only gas station for more than a year and a half without any qualms about the fuel prices.

That's back when Joe David, the shop owner, was a political ally.

But now that David started opposing a proposed property tax increase in El Mirage, city officials are taking their business -- and city sales tax dollars -- to neighboring cities.

El Mirage spends about $20,000 a month on fuel costs, estimates David, who owns the Shell gas station on El Mirage and Cactus roads.

City Manager Spencer Isom did not return New Times' phone calls seeking comment.


David tells New Times that he never had any issues with the current slate of elected officials.

In fact, he says he helped get them elected.

He says he allowed now-Mayor Lana Mook and the other candidates in her camp put their signs in his store and even told his customers that they should vote for them.

David, who felt a certain obligation to "take care of them," would throw in discounted car washes for city vehicles, free car wash upgrades, and some elected officials would even help themselves to free car washes.

Then, elected officials agreed to ask voters to approve an $8.5 million bond in November to build a police station and a YMCA with a swimming pool. It would mean a property tax increase for residents and business owners.

"I already pay $75,000 a year in property taxes," David says. "I can't afford anymore, and neither can these poor people living in the city." (In addition to the gas station, David owns 9 acres of property on the same corner.)

He allowed El Mirage residents who want to recall Mook, over higher water rates and now, this bond election that would increase property tax increase, to put a petition on his store counter.

On August 26, at least two councilmen -- Roy Delgado and Jack Palladino -- spotted the petitions.

That same day, Palladino sent an e-mail to City Manager Spencer Isom, suggesting the city take its business elsewhere, writing that he "can't help wondering what kind of savings we would have if we shopped around for a better price."

Also on that day, Delgado's name appeared on a complaint to Shell corporate officials letting them know he was "extremely upset that this one station in El Mirage has an owner that is soliciting signatures against their mayor."

Delgado tells New Times that he won't be spending any of his money there.

"I'm a customer and I have the right to go elsewhere," he says, balking at critics' assertions that a bond election will increase property taxes too much. "The residents are voting on this. We're not forcing them."

He adds that a recall election would cost taxpayers about $40,000.

After concerns were raised about prices -- again, more than a year after they'd loyally fueling up at the El Mirage station to support local businesses -- David told city officials that if they obtained a free Shell fleet card, they could earn a 3 to 4 percent rebate on their fuel costs.

Palladino wasn't swayed, and apparently sent out an e-mail about boycotting the Shell station.

He also wrote to Isom on September 7 that, even with the rebate, "I think that we have to continue to shop for the best fuel price ... if he comes out the lowest, fine. If Mr. David can guarantee the city will receive the lowest price for fuel than [sic] any other station in the area, then we should look at what he has to offer. I would think a discount of 3 to 4 percent would come out to what we are paying at the other stations. Is there any other incentive he can add for the city?"

City Manager Isom sent a letter to David on August 31 telling him that it is the "city's practice to, when all things are equal, to shop local."

He writes to the El Mirage business owner that "... 'equal' isn't an absolute as there are other things to consider." Isom never explains what other factors the city is considering in deciding where to spend its money.

David knows.

"This doesn't have anything to do with price, it's all about politics," he says. "They didn't have any problem with the prices before."

At the end of the letter, after notifying David that city staff will be periodically be searching for the cheapest gas prices at stations within two miles of the city, Isom writes that "again, 'equal' is not an absolute."
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279 comments
ivan1976m
ivan1976m

Hi,

Let me start off with these comments are just a bunch of stones being thrown by mature adults who have no other important business in their lives.  My parents live in the older part of el mirage by the city courts and when I started my family I moved to the new areas of el mirage by the shell gas station, where I currently live and raising my family. I have one special needs child and I know there is more here in el mirage and I have not seen anything done for them but you people sure do spend your time gossiping and fighting about things that are just politics.


My family knows  this reporter very well and she should be more interested about writing about her family members on her fathers side of the family. She has siblings that are in PRISON for serious crimes and doing hard time.  I hear through people that are close to her that she has a great side kick in town that feeds her bullshit.  This big fat woman named Linda Kleiner from the Cactus Park HOA. Kliener and her family are nothing but a bunch of unemployed, low class, government dependent moochers and lying fools.  Did you all know that the Klieners were sued for $5000.00 dollars because they tried to pull the wool over the  eyes of a retired Sun City couple that let them borrow the money so these low lifes wouldn't lose there house to foreclosure.  Linda kleiner used the courts system to avoid paying the older couple and her attorney Flaeen defended this liar?  I would venture to know more about the hidden secrets of this fat ass and her misfit family.  So if anyone has any dirt on these fools please comment so we know what kind of punks we are listening too. 


Maybe this FAT ASS Linda Kleiner, should get a job and her family members too, so this way they can pay their bills and pay their taxes.  As to the city government, I think you are doing a good job, yes you always need to tighten up loose ends and keep a vital look  of checks and balances on all ways that would save our city money.  WE SUPPORT YOU AND DON'T LET THE BIG FAT MOUTH OF LINDA KLEINER STOP YOU FROM DOING A GREAT JOB.  HAPPY IN EL MIRAGE.

criz
criz

I see that El Mirage is no better off then it was 30 years ago, b4 it was that the representatives were not educated, now all u new educated newcomers are doinf the exact same thing, WILL EL MIRAGE EVER SEE A TIME WHEN THINGS ARE DONE FOR WHAT IS BEST FOR THE PEOPLE AND NOT FOR SPECIAL INTEREST GROUPS

Tony Simek
Tony Simek

Typical El Mirage politics...MOOK Style.

Eccentric
Eccentric

The next time Laurie and Frank Carnal decide they want to fuck with someone's background with a lie about the militia, make sure they leave the vacilline behind; the reach-around feels more natural when you're pulling your collective dick-length out of the victims ass!

Glenresident
Glenresident

While you  are bitting eachothers heads off and barking at eah other like dogs and cats, other cities and their representatives are getting a laugh out of all you. Hahaha since when do you hear of city officials boycotting their own city revenues, i hope joe david takes his bussiness to a different city where he is treated by the city officials better, and the el mirage city is left without his tax money, you fools you are an emberasment to this country and mostly to your city, glad i dont live there. Pleae proceed to entertain me with all your knoledge and as i read before your education... 

recall#3
recall#3

After doing some research on YMCA's throughout the valley this is what I have discovered about their organization.  A YMCA membership gives you FREE fitness classes,  FREE water fitness,  FREE child watch while adults work out.  Reduced rates on swim lessons,  reduced rates on youth sports, summer day camp and after school programs. A person can volunteer to be a positive role model for at-risk youth.  They provide programs for adults and youth of Character Education to build TRUSTWORTHINESS, REPECT, RESPONSIBILITY, FAIRNESS, CARING AND CITIZENSHIP  .They provide teen leadership, arts, humanities.  They provide swimming, sports and play.  They provide camp for youth.  They provide family time, health and well being, sports and recreation, adult and youth swimming.  They porvide group interests, social services, global services and encourage volunteerism.  BUT YOU DON'T WANT THAT IN THIS TOWN.  YOU WANT TO LIVE IN ONE OF THOSE CITYS THAT DO NOTHING TO IMPROVE THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR ITS RESIDENTS.   I'm so glad you are totally on the opposite side of what the majority of El Mirage citizens want.

 

Msg USAFR RET
Msg USAFR RET

Roger what are you a Sgt in? Would it be you are a Sgt in the militia working for your buddy General Frizzell 

Deceit
Deceit

WOW I am astonished be some of these coments, we are expressing our concern for el mirage bussiness and u fools act like dogs fighting for a piece of meat, u should be ashame of yourselves for pointing fingers at each other u look like complete idiots going at eachother, what happen to unity, toguether we stand i am ashame to know some of you are leading this contry and u should wanna be the example for future generations to be involved in politics, i am only 21 and i know better than that. what has this country become.

recall#3
recall#3

All of you who are so impressed with Councilman James McPhetres need to know and understand that just a year ago, I along with MANY other El Mirage residents felt just like you do about Jim. We worked long and hard to get him elected to the council.   We thought he would make a great leader.  As it turns out Jim doesn't want to lead the city any place positive-He wants it to stay stagnant.  He is such a hard headed fiscal conservative that he doesn't want a dime spent on progress.  You don't deserve it.  He likes our police station, thinks it's adequate, you don't deserve better. We certainly don't need a recreational facility, Jim can go the to Luke Air Force Base and use their facility.  You don't need or deserve anything like that.  We don't need electronic billboards at Gateway Park to let residents know of upcoming events or to let people know what is going on in the community.  (no matter what Jim tells you, this Administration is very open about city business). Jim thinks you don't deserve to know.  He voted against the city putting up billboards on Grand Ave. which will bring in revenue to the city.  He voted against recycling.  Even tho all other citys are doing it.  We don't deserve it.  He voted against widening El Mirage Rd.  We don't deserve safer, better roads in our city.  He voted against giving El Mirage staff a week off between Christmas and New Year at no expense to the city.  The employees haven't had a raise in two years and this is how the city is trying to make it up to them.  But Jim thinks they don't deserve it.    I don't remember how he voted on the new fire station but knowing his record--he voted against it.  We don't deserve anything nice, our police & firemen don't deserve anything adequate.  So go ahead and listen to McPhetres, someday in the near future you will figure what you are really dealing with.  He is a user.  He will use you just like he used me and MANY others.  I guess it's your turn.

recall#3
recall#3

After reading and writing comments on this blog I have come to this conclusion. There are  a few El Mirage residents that:Don't want a YMCA even tho it would be great for the city and for the residents young and old.Don't want a new Police station because the police should always be in their cars and on the streets.Don't want a community garden and a farmers market even tho it would be great for the city and the residents young and old and at no cost to the city.Want the busiest corner in town to remain a dirt lot and as ugly as sin.Don't want the city to get the best possible gas prices for their vehicles.Don't want the present council making decisions for them and their families but would rather have drug pushers, thieves, a person with a restraining order against him, the town lier, the town bully, a militia/whitesupremacist, a bigot, a nut case or someone who has never attended a City Council Meeting and knows nothing about city government to making decisions for them and their families.Your hero is a business owner who charges you some of the highest prices in the valley.Your other hero is a woman who lies, cheats, cons do-gooders out of money, and cannot pass a background check.Man, I'm so glad there are only a handful of you ignormamuses.

recall#3
recall#3

So Jim, You are working on a recall against the mayor and 2 other councilmembers in order to silence dissent.  It's okay for you but not anyone else??  

ProBondProElMirage
ProBondProElMirage

I'm still waiting for someone, anyone, to tell me what wonderful things Linda has done for the City in the last 6 months.  I'm sure she has you all believing she is the return of the savior but she is all talk.

wakeuptoreality
wakeuptoreality

Linda Kleiner is much too lazy to do a real day's work. She wants to ride around in her car all day, talk on the phone and try to impress people about how helpful she is to the city. Too bad she did not take the time to check out her new buddies,,,Frizzel the Neo-Nazi skinhead and the twin fools from McPhetres HOA.  Oh wait, no need to have facts just act like you know what is true and people fall all over themselves to repeat your hateful trash. This is how Linda Kleiner operates and she is very proud of being able to dish out misinformation then brag on how fast it gets back to her. How much money has she already scammed from the poor disadvantaged people going to Pastor Lupe's church and those foolish enough to donate to herlatest scheme?

Disgusted with Politicians
Disgusted with Politicians

Wow can't believe everything going on.  I did request information about the recalls but no has seen fit to answer me and where I can help? Guess that is all it is, just talk on blogs and no action, how sad.

wakeuptoreality
wakeuptoreality

Reply to Bob: You obviously have never seen the Dysart Community Center. It cannot be expanded, the buildings are very old, even the AC works off & on. The grounds are too small for renovation that could handle the population needs since it was build many years ago. They do a good job with the limited funding they get but the city needs a much larger facility with a pool.If we want this community to prosper, attract jobs and people to move in to the many vacant homes we have we must offer much more than we have now. Otherwise we just keep on with the failed policies of the past...look where that got us. Businesses will come here if we show we want people to live, work & play in El Mirage. Otherwise they will continue to go to our neighboring cities that do offer amenities.

rememberingthefacts
rememberingthefacts

Vera's comments show she probably doesn't know Linda well yet, she must be still accepting her 5-10 phone calls every day and bragging about how powerful she is among the politically elite. You will soon learn that she is only out for herself, never contributes anything herself, relies on scamming organizations like Dysart Community center and churches out of their money...what for you ask? To buy her ridiculous anti graffiti comic book for $3.00 each. That way she doesn't have to get a job. She can sponge off her parents and get people like McPhetres all hyped up on ponzi insurance scams. Oh wait...he couldn't even pass the tests! His wife did but he couldn't. Sounds like the military finally woke up since he is being forced out in March.

rememberingthe facts
rememberingthe facts

Councilmembers Selby and Ramirez had McPhetres number even before the A-team was formed to run for office. Both men seriously questioned having McPhetres on the ballot due to some of his screwy ideas. Even the previous mayor was telling everyone McPhetres was not what he said he was. The moth has emerged from the cocoon as a flaming friend of a well known bigot and women hater who could not even get m, a council member who has 2 restraining orders against him from FAMILY, an HOA president who does not attend HOA President's meetings because he does not want to get the updates of what the city is doing directly from staff to take back to his HOA members. He would rather get the nonsense, lying version from McPhetres so he can sent uninformed, twisted emails to the mayor and city manager. Then you have Mr. Frizzel, a militia general from Prescott, you know, the skinhead variety, who has his own history of legal problems, circulates recall petitions with no factual data whatsoever, just crap that McPhetres has told him.

therealpeopleofelmirage
therealpeopleofelmirage

I'd like to suggest since McPhetres and his gang do not support the YMCA or police, we give every kid in El Mirage Jim McPhetes address so they can go swimming at his house all summer.And since he doesn't believe in public safety it won't be a concern if 100 kids show up!Maybe he'll call his buddy Eric Frizzell over to help. You remember, he took this man to a Republican meeting and he also had him sign the recall papers left at the Shell Station. The papers he signed as he was witness to every signature BEFORE any signaturres had been collected. Seems Eric Frizzell is a known member of the Militia (who once had invited Tim McVey to speak before his group) and is a White Supremist and Neo Nazi. If you don't believe this just google him. It's all there on the internet. Now what do you think Joe David??? Nice new friends you made. Linda, Is this your hope for El Mirage? You planning on having him run for office? Why don't you have him over for dinner? Let him meet the relatives.

Disgusted with Politicians
Disgusted with Politicians

Just found this blog, and I like it, I'm new to the area and am really tired of all these goverment officials upping my taxes at thier whim.  I can't wait for voting season, what in november for this BS bond issue? and next year when i can vote out every incumbent there is on city, county state and federal goverment, time to get new blood in office.  If ther e is a recall petition going around like some say in here just let me know where I  can find one to sign.

recall#3
recall#3

Another question for all of you who say they want to keep your tax dollars in El Mirage...One of the gentlemen who is heading up recall # 3 on Mayor Mook, Councilman Delgado and Councilman Palledino and who is blogging on these blogs, owns a business called Youngtown Car Care, and yes it is in Youngtown. You should move your home to Youngtown Mr. Winefsky, they don't have a property tax or a YMCA. But they do have a gas station that doesn't screw you upon every visit. I guess you want us to believe you don't buy your gas in Youngtown where your business is and the prices are better but you buy your gas in El Mirage just so El Mirage can have your tax dollars.I don't think so.   So much for his tax dollars going to El Mirage.  Linda Kleiner who also is active in the recall and is blogging as thepeopleofelmirage NEVER shops in El Mirage.  She shops at Walmart on Lake Pleasant Rd. I know without a doubt that Linda doesn't buy her gas at Joe Davids Shell Station, she avoids any business that over charges.   And who is the hypocrite here???  Not the City of El Mirage!!!!

Whatever
Whatever

And every time we see an article that shows this group and their antics does the city manager refuse to comment and explain their decision?  What happened to this council and city  leadership saying they want to be upfront and hide nothing from the citizens?  What are you hiding?

urallcrazy
urallcrazy

CRIZ---TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION---THE TIME IS NOW.... THIS SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP ALONG WITH THE PEOPLE OF EL MIRAGE JUST DID IT... A BOND TO BUILD A NEW POLICE STATION AND REC. FACILITY WAS JUST PASSED "FOR THE PEOPLE"...  DROP BY AND WORK OUT SOMETIME AND SEE ALL THE "PEOPLE OF EL MIRAGE" THAT WILL BE USING IT, OR DROP BY OUR NEW GATEWAY PARK WHERE YOU AND THE  "PEOPLE OF EL MIRAGE" CAN BUY YOURSELF AN ICE CREAM AT KARENS CREAMERY THEN WALK AROUND THE WALKING PATH AND WORK IT OFF ALONG WITH NUMEROUS "PEOPLE OF EL MIRAGE"....  TAKE YOUR KIDS AND THEY CAN SKATEBOARD, PLAY BASKETBALL OR SOFTBALL OR SOCCER WITH "PEOPLE FROM EL MIRAGE"...  SOON YOU AND THE "PEOPLE OF EL MIRAGE" WILL HAVE THE CHOICE OF 2 (TWO) NEW PARKS AS GENTRY PARK IS GETTING A COMPLETE MAKEOVER...  EL MIRAGE IS ALSO GETTING A BRAND NEW FIRE STATION.  WOULD YOU SAY THAT A NEW FIRE STATION IS SOMETHING THAT "IS BEST FOR THE PEOPLE"????  I THINK YOU WOULD HAVE TO SAY YES....THERE IS A COMMUNITY GARDEN GOING IN ON THE CORNER OF THUNDERBIRD AND EL MIRAGE RD.  THE "PEOPLE OF EL MIRAGE" CAN GROW A GARDEN IF THEY SO DESIRE...  TREES AND OTHER GARDENING PRODUCTS ARE BEING DONATED BY BUSINESSES IN THE AREA...THAT'S JUST TO MENTION A FEW THINGS THIS "SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP" HAS BEEN DOING. 

Whatever
Whatever

They really are embarrassing.

Michael
Michael

I don't live there either and I also had a good laugh and glad I don't live there.

recall#3
recall#3

USAFR RET--How would you like to follow Jim McPhetres into battle???  He'd have you dead within 20 minutes.  He'd join the enemy and turn treasonous on his own people.  Oh wait, he's already done that right here in El Mirage.

ProBondProElMirage
ProBondProElMirage

If you have so much concern for this City and it's future, I suggest you start going to City Council meetings and get involved in the decisions that are made.  Of course, I don't believe for a minute that this is a 21 year old unless you are Roger's son since you make the same horrible spelling and typing mistakes that he does.  If you are a product of public schools then we need to increase spending for education.

ProBondProElMirage
ProBondProElMirage

They have all gotten so quiet I think they realize just how stupid they sound.  We have facts to back up all the things we say about McPhetres and they can only make generalizations and have no facts to back anything up.  Guess they put their tail between their legs and signed off.

recall#3
recall#3

Well wait a minute ProBondProElMirage--She did turn Mike Humes in to channel 15 so they could do their infamous interview with him regarding crime and drugs.  That was a GREAT thing for the city!!

ProBondProElMirage
ProBondProElMirage

Not sure you really want to get involved with these guys.  The petitions they had out to recall the Mayor were illegal.  Best cover your own a** before you get involved.  McPhetres will throw anyone under the bus to save himself.

recall#3
recall#3

Let me help you..Go on the El Mirage City Web site and get Councilman James McPhetres city phone number and call him up.  He'll give you all the information that you will need to join up.  Then when you get information from him--jump back on the blogs and let us know what he said!!!!

ProBondProElMirage
ProBondProElMirage

Roger Cleveland and Hugh Flysin were at the same Republican LD12 meeting.  You know what they say, birds of a feather.  Jin McPhetres, Eric Frizzell, Roger Cleveland and Hugh Flysin, just one ig happy family.  Of course, I would never want anyone associated with a known militia member sitting on the council.  We already have one there but if you guys think you will get more you are mistaken.  Mr. Frizzell's history speaks for itself.

Vera
Vera

I too are disgusted with these Politicians who took office to help the poeple.  There different alright, they are more seekie, and deceptive than anyone El Mirage ever had.  They up your taxes so they can hire more of their friends at higher wages.  Look who is their buddy Bill Pupo who left Surprise a financial mess because he allowed his buddy in Surprise Financial Director Robert Nilles to run their Accounting Dept.  Both created millions of dollars errors and now there here in El Mirage, with their buddy Spencer and Sharon Antes who approve everything Pupo and Nilles suggest.  What a web they created.

GetGone
GetGone

This is just a smoke screen of your words atleast Linda Kleiner and Joe Davids stand up for what is fair and right.  It is a common knowledge that City staff buy outside of El Mirage even their lunches that are bought for their interview panels is bought outside El Mirage at the Paradise Cafe in Surprise by Sandy King, HR Dir.  If audit after BJ Cornwall former City Manager who  resigned will see  that they buy outside.  (BJ was for the Business Owner and watched for the people) only down fall was the Luke thing and that the Fire Fighters didn't want to lose their pay, didn't want a reduction in pay so they attacked BJ to keep their pay, that was what that was about and the people bought into it. Check the Fire Fighters pay, I believe Captains make as much as the current City Manager without the perks.

Roger C.
Roger C.

THERE R no Excuses 4 u PEROID. LAuRiE cArNal AuRiE cArNal except that not only r u a meop, member, but also a disgrace to all CitizensCitizens of El Mirage. Since you are incapable of an Honest Apology. One can only assume due to your lack and limited education. the only way an the only way an apology can or will be excepted would be face to face. That is if you are capable of anything honest?

ProBondProElMirage
ProBondProElMirage

Roger, sorry.  In my frustration I forgot about your sons untimely passing.  I was only trying to make the point that everyone knows this is you and you don't need to change names to make your point.

recall#3
recall#3

Never fear,  They're probably meeting someplace as we speak to plot the next assult.  I'm ready, how about you ProBondProElMirage?  We've got facts and truths on our side, they have lies and stupidity.  As someone once said "Bring It On"

MSantiago
MSantiago

So Linda K and her group consist of someone who doesn't know how to tell the truth and is using El Mirage as a stepping stone(JMCP), a militia man and white Supremacist (EF),a bigot (HF) and a fruit cake  who has restraining orders against him by his own family(RC), along with the instigator who can't find a legit job (LK).

I'll stick with what we have, they have made great strides for the city in the very short time they have been in office. They even reversed our reputation in the West Valley that Cleveland had a hand in ruining.

I've never met you personally, but you have a big Thank You from me and all my gratitude!!.

recall#3
recall#3

Vera, When Linda Kleiner tells you she was and educator and owned a school--  DON'T BELIEVE HER, SHE WAS PROBABLY THE JANITOR.  When she tell you she worked for John Kennedy--  DON'T BELIEVE HER, SHE WAS PROBABLY THE JANITOR.

recall#3
recall#3

B.J.'s ONLY downfall...???? Vere. Vera.Vera what planet have you been living on?  B.J.was not pro-el Mirage on anything.  He tried his hardest to destroy this city and almost did.  You Vera have no idea how bad he was for YOUR community.  You think that B.J. watched for the people (as you put it)  I think you mean he watched out for the people which is absolutely false.  He only cared about the people who could give him what he wanted and that would be 4 voters on the Council.  Remember if you were close to B.J. you need to know that his favorite saying was "Keep those you dislike close." 

ProBondProElMirage
ProBondProElMirage

And BJ being the highest paid City Manager with the best perks (corvette) in the entire valley wasn't an issue for you?  He was paid more than the City Managers of much larger cities.  The firefighters did make concessions in their contract which is more than I can say for BJ.

Roger C,.
Roger C,.

THERE R no Excuses 4 u PEROID. LAuRiE cArNal AuRiE cArNal except that not only r u a meop, member, but also a disgrace to all CitizensCitizens of El Mirage. Since you are incapable of an Honest Apology. One can only assume due to your lack and limited education. the only way an the only way an apology can or will be excepted would be face to face. That is if you are capable of anything honest?

Deceit
Deceit

suppositions just as the ones you claimed in response to my first post. wow all that assumption just by what i posted for being concerned. The article does people like you justice look at the way you express yourself, all because i have a point of view different to yours.

ProBondProElMirage
ProBondProElMirage

wow,all those suppositions just because I can spell and use grammar.  It must be tough to be as all knowing as you are.

Deceit
Deceit

actually you are wrong again, see how your first reacton is to turn and point fingers, people like you are disgusting in every aspect and you are not worth the time to check my spelling and i assume you send your kids to private schools were they become complete f*** ups and you are probably one of those parents who cover up their childrens mistakes and you think that makes your childrem better invest time in self improvement go get yourself some morals.

Elmirage
Elmirage

wow we went from expressing concerns to plotting assaults how nicely expressed what happen to civilized behavior???

recall#3
recall#3

Hey MSantiago--Remember Mike Humes--the thief and drug dealer that Flisyn and Cleveland ran with during the last election?...Don't count him out of the picture--he fits in really well with these wanna be's..

recall#3
recall#3

And don't forget the two rude dudes at the last Council Meeting.  Protocol????What's that?

Vera
Vera

It took him 6 years to get that.  What do you think the current City Manager will get in 6 years if he makes it.  Remember it was the Council who gives them their raises.

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